Comments on: Citysearch Pay-Per-Click Advertising & Click Fraud: My Adventure http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/ Just another WordPress weblog Wed, 03 Mar 2010 17:20:16 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Marcie Judelson http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5262 Marcie Judelson Sat, 03 Oct 2009 19:12:05 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5262 Wow. I decided to do a quick search to see if my experience with City Search was an exception or if others were having similar problems. Many of these comments echo my exact experience. I smelled a scam, and now I know my instincts were correct. Like others, I was given the hard sell (by a very nice, friendly sales rep) about the benefits of advertising my small business on CS (they found me...saw my local newspaper ad). Although I was wary, I was also excited about the prospect of greatly increasing traffic to my site. So I was willing to give it a try. I don't remember the exact "max" I agreed to, but it was probably about $400. I thought it was expensive, but they said it was unlikely I'd get that many clicks and offered to give me all kinds of breaks for signing up. First, there were nothing but problems setting up my listing. Chronic mispellings, glaring errors, etc. It took about a month to get it all fixed. These were the kinds of simple fixes a good Web person could do in a matter of minutes - but it took forever. Once the posting was finally up and running (with user reviews), I never receieved even a single call or inquiry from anyone. I was billed for $198 the first time. The next bill was much higher: $369.45. Still with ZERO responses. When I inquired about this, I was told about a complicated click/view/charge methodology - but of course, the actual account activity is not transparent to the user. I decided I couldn't afford to continue, and ended my account in early July. I was just billed again - for August - and it's the EXACT SAME AMOUNT: $369.45. I contacted my Rep to say I think I was accidentally charged again - and by the way, it's the same amount to the penny as last time - and they should refund my credit card. I was told no, it was a LEGITIMATE CHARGE and I had been warned I'd be charged for another cycle even after my cancellation (this was not my understanding). I had to fight with my formerly nice Rep and threaten to contact her Supervisor...she finally agreed to refund the last amount. All in all, I was charged over $900 - and never got a single response. A small space newspaper ad usually garners 1-5 calls...and costs under $200. Something is rotten in Denmark. I suspect I was overcharged the entire time - but have no way of proving it. I would agree to participate in any class action suit against City Search. They are running an unethical operation and it needs to be investigated. Wow. I decided to do a quick search to see if my experience with City Search was an exception or if others were having similar problems. Many of these comments echo my exact experience. I smelled a scam, and now I know my instincts were correct.

Like others, I was given the hard sell (by a very nice,
friendly sales rep) about the benefits of advertising my small business on CS (they found me…saw my local newspaper ad). Although I was wary, I was also excited about the prospect of greatly increasing traffic to my site. So I was willing to give it a try.

I don’t remember the exact “max” I agreed to, but it was probably about $400. I thought it was expensive, but they said it was unlikely I’d get that many clicks and offered to give me all kinds of breaks for signing up.

First, there were nothing but problems setting up my listing. Chronic mispellings, glaring errors, etc.
It took about a month to get it all fixed. These were
the kinds of simple fixes a good Web person could do
in a matter of minutes – but it took forever.

Once the posting was finally up and running (with user reviews), I never receieved even a single call or inquiry from anyone. I was billed for $198
the first time. The next bill was much higher: $369.45. Still with ZERO responses. When I inquired about this, I was told about a complicated click/view/charge methodology – but of course, the actual account activity is not transparent to the user.

I decided I couldn’t afford to continue, and ended my
account in early July. I was just billed again -
for August – and it’s the EXACT SAME AMOUNT: $369.45.
I contacted my Rep to say I think I was accidentally
charged again – and by the way, it’s the same amount to the penny as last time – and they should refund my credit card. I was told no, it was a LEGITIMATE CHARGE and I had been warned I’d be charged for another cycle
even after my cancellation (this was not my understanding).

I had to fight with my formerly nice Rep and threaten to contact her Supervisor…she finally agreed to
refund the last amount.

All in all, I was charged over $900 – and never got a single response. A small space newspaper ad usually garners 1-5 calls…and costs under $200.

Something is rotten in Denmark. I suspect I was overcharged the entire time – but have no way of proving it. I would agree to participate in any class action suit against City Search. They are running an unethical operation and it needs to be investigated.

]]> By: Darrell Mirsky http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5261 Darrell Mirsky Fri, 02 Oct 2009 00:01:27 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5261 Experiencing the same as all of the above, only I'm stuck in a three month contract with a $2,000.00 monthly budget. How on earth could I be getting as many clicks as they claim (spent entire budget within two weeks), however I have yet to receive one phone call from a prospect saying that they got our name from my CitySearch campaign. I have since contacted the BBB, the attorney general office of Washington, and am looking for other avenues. Any suggestions are welcome. Experiencing the same as all of the above, only I’m stuck in a three month contract with a $2,000.00 monthly budget. How on earth could I be getting as many clicks as they claim (spent entire budget within two weeks), however I have yet to receive one phone call from a prospect saying that they got our name from my CitySearch campaign. I have since contacted the BBB, the attorney general office of Washington, and am looking for other avenues. Any suggestions are welcome.

]]> By: Rich Rockwell http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5253 Rich Rockwell Sun, 27 Sep 2009 21:28:52 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5253 I had a similar experience to others reported here. I agreed to the CitySearch plan of charging 50 cents per click with a budget of $350 because I thought I would only get a few clicks a week (based on other web traffic for my web site). They mysteriously came up with enough clicks to equal $350.00 with no evidence that these are legitimate clicks. If they are legitimate clicks, they should be able to provide statistics showing what geographic area the clicks came from, where they were referred from, and what search phrase was used. Another reason I agreed to their plan was that I thought it would raise my prominence on search engine search results pages and it didn't do that either. My CitySearch ad was usually at the bottom of the page on search results. If people are using google, Yahoo and Bing to search for restaurants like mine, they would get other links for my site above the CitySearch link, and I think they would click those instead of clicking on the CitySearch link - another reason to wonder exactly where the clicks came from. Their customer service is bad (I had numerous emails to them that were not answered), their user interface is bad (there are many things you can't change and for the things you can change, you have to wait hours to see the change published), and their ad writing help was a joke, Basically, they wanted me to pay $350 for something I can get better and for free from the search engines and other sites where you can register a business. I feel lucky to have only gotten ripped of for $350 compared to other people's horror stories. They did let me cancel after one month. It was a learning experience for me. I'll never do something like that again, and I'll be sure to do some research if I am tempted to do something like this in the future. I had a similar experience to others reported here. I agreed to the CitySearch plan of charging 50 cents per click with a budget of $350 because I thought I would only get a few clicks a week (based on other web traffic for my web site). They mysteriously came up with enough clicks to equal $350.00 with no evidence that these are legitimate clicks. If they are legitimate clicks, they should be able to provide statistics showing what geographic area the clicks came from, where they were referred from, and what search phrase was used. Another reason I agreed to their plan was that I thought it would raise my prominence on search engine search results pages and it didn’t do that either. My CitySearch ad was usually at the bottom of the page on search results. If people are using google, Yahoo and Bing to search for restaurants like mine, they would get other links for my site above the CitySearch link, and I think they would click those instead of clicking on the CitySearch link – another reason to wonder exactly where the clicks came from. Their customer service is bad (I had numerous emails to them that were not answered), their user interface is bad (there are many things you can’t change and for the things you can change, you have to wait hours to see the change published), and their ad writing help was a joke, Basically, they wanted me to pay $350 for something I can get better and for free from the search engines and other sites where you can register a business. I feel lucky to have only gotten ripped of for $350 compared to other people’s horror stories. They did let me cancel after one month. It was a learning experience for me. I’ll never do something like that again, and I’ll be sure to do some research if I am tempted to do something like this in the future.

]]> By: Bobby Booey http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5235 Bobby Booey Wed, 16 Sep 2009 23:51:00 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5235 I an a wedding videographer. I knew something was wrong when I was getting 5 to 6 times more clicks from citysearch, which is not known for weddings, then from major sites dedicated only to weddings, like the knot. I an a wedding videographer. I knew something was wrong when I was getting 5 to 6 times more clicks from citysearch, which is not known for weddings, then from major sites dedicated only to weddings, like the knot.

]]> By: Don http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5220 Don Fri, 11 Sep 2009 08:06:18 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5220 Unfortunately, my small business signed up with CitySearch.com. They completed the contract and did not provide us with a copy. The contract was altered, but they said we signed it after the alterations. Of course, they only gave us a copy of the contract 2 weeks later, when I had to request it from them. (We paid $1.00 per click MAX $600 per month) Needless to say, 7 days in a week, we would have 175 clicks in one day, next day 2 click, next day 3 clicks, then -0-, next day 7 click, and so on. I repeatedly asked for documentation to ensure there were not mulitple clicks from the same person (citysearch employee), but I was told they (the sales team) did not have any way of tracking it. Of course, the bill came out each month to our maximum of $600.00 (what a surprise). I sent several emails, made many phone calls, to no avail. Same reply, same no help. (they were getting their money, so no skin off of their back) I finally stopped paying the last 2 months, to try to get their attention. All that did was remove me from CitySearch (no loss), but I did not want to mess up my credit. I called the billing department and paid the balance in full 1 month after the contract ended. One month after I paid, I started to get calls and letters from a Credit Collection Company. I called them and advised the bill was paid in full and provided them with the persons name and extension to contact at CitySearch. This bill was paid on 6-9-09.....they are still indicating that I owe the balance as of today. I am SO fed up with CitySearch I cannot see straight. I filed a complaint with the BBB, and nothing really came out of it. They have an uneducated person replying back to the complaints. Amazingly enough, when you look up CitySearch on the BBB, they are rated as an A+, but all the reviews and comments are one star or less. When I went to school, one star was a failure and 5 stars was excellent. Guess I am too dumb to figure this one out! BTW.......Still hating CitySearch..... What comes around goes around!!!! Unfortunately, my small business signed up with CitySearch.com. They completed the contract and did not provide us with a copy. The contract was altered, but they said we signed it after the alterations. Of course, they only gave us a copy of the contract 2 weeks later, when I had to request it from them. (We paid $1.00 per click MAX $600 per month) Needless to say, 7 days in a week, we would have 175 clicks in one day, next day 2 click, next day 3 clicks, then -0-, next day 7 click, and so on. I repeatedly asked for documentation to ensure there were not mulitple clicks from the same person (citysearch employee), but I was told they (the sales team) did not have any way of tracking it. Of course, the bill came out each month to our maximum of $600.00 (what a surprise). I sent several emails, made many phone calls, to no avail. Same reply, same no help. (they were getting their money, so no skin off of their back)
I finally stopped paying the last 2 months, to try to get their attention. All that did was remove me from CitySearch (no loss), but I did not want to mess up my credit. I called the billing department and paid the balance in full 1 month after the contract ended. One month after I paid, I started to get calls and letters from a Credit Collection Company. I called them and advised the bill was paid in full and provided them with the persons name and extension to contact at CitySearch. This bill was paid on 6-9-09…..they are still indicating that I owe the balance as of today.

I am SO fed up with CitySearch I cannot see straight. I filed a complaint with the BBB, and nothing really came out of it. They have an uneducated person replying back to the complaints. Amazingly enough, when you look up CitySearch on the BBB, they are rated as an A+, but all the reviews and comments are one star or less. When I went to school, one star was a failure and 5 stars was excellent. Guess I am too dumb to figure this one out!
BTW…….Still hating CitySearch….. What comes around goes around!!!!

]]> By: Stephanie http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5218 Stephanie Thu, 10 Sep 2009 01:30:01 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5218 We are a small hair salon in NYC. Several months ago, we agreed to use CitySearch to help drive traffic to our site and store. We were told we would be charged for calls made through their site and they set up a mask phone number to track the calls they generated to us. In 3 months, we received 13 phone calls, which resulted in 3 bookings. Not too much to complain about there, but certainly not stellar response. The kicker came when our introductory period expired and that day we went from 12 connections to 157 in one day. Of course, that did not translate to any traffic to the store or even our website. Our account manager was very disappointed but not terribly surprised when we called to cancel our account. We are now in the process of canceling our credit card since we're pretty sure there's no easy way of getting them to cancel our account and stop billing us. Honestly, our strongest traffic comes from organic google searches. Talk to your web developer about optimizing your site - ours did a great job. And if you're looking for bang for your buck, definitely go for Google AdWords. We are a small hair salon in NYC. Several months ago, we agreed to use CitySearch to help drive traffic to our site and store. We were told we would be charged for calls made through their site and they set up a mask phone number to track the calls they generated to us. In 3 months, we received 13 phone calls, which resulted in 3 bookings. Not too much to complain about there, but certainly not stellar response. The kicker came when our introductory period expired and that day we went from 12 connections to 157 in one day. Of course, that did not translate to any traffic to the store or even our website. Our account manager was very disappointed but not terribly surprised when we called to cancel our account. We are now in the process of canceling our credit card since we’re pretty sure there’s no easy way of getting them to cancel our account and stop billing us. Honestly, our strongest traffic comes from organic google searches. Talk to your web developer about optimizing your site – ours did a great job. And if you’re looking for bang for your buck, definitely go for Google AdWords.

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5182 Jill Olkoski Thu, 20 Aug 2009 22:43:45 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5182 Hi Michael, A competitive search engine?! Outrageous! Hi Michael,
A competitive search engine?! Outrageous!

]]> By: Michael http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5181 Michael Thu, 20 Aug 2009 22:38:04 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5181 Thanks for this--what you are doing is actually a valuable service. The yellow pages, citysearch, and all these 2nd and 3rd tier directories are getting desperate. I actually had a salesman from citysearch tell me that they were a competitive search engine. Then, when he told me that the program was pay per click, I offered my prediction: citysearch will go out of business. Thanks for this–what you are doing is actually a valuable service. The yellow pages, citysearch, and all these 2nd and 3rd tier directories are getting desperate. I actually had a salesman from citysearch tell me that they were a competitive search engine. Then, when he told me that the program was pay per click, I offered my prediction: citysearch will go out of business.

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5039 Jill Olkoski Thu, 18 Jun 2009 20:01:10 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5039 Hi Alan, I'm so sorry to hear about your experience and appreciate you posting the details here to help others. Tracking your website traffic is a very important thing to do, especially if you're paying for clicks. I wonder if part of the discrepancy between Google Analytics and Citysearch has to do with tracking clicks on the Citysearch internal website, versus sending folks to your website. Just a guess, because that's a huge difference. Hi Alan,
I’m so sorry to hear about your experience and appreciate you posting the details here to help others. Tracking your website traffic is a very important thing to do, especially if you’re paying for clicks. I wonder if part of the discrepancy between Google Analytics and Citysearch has to do with tracking clicks on the Citysearch internal website, versus sending folks to your website. Just a guess, because that’s a huge difference.

]]> By: Alan http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-5038 Alan Thu, 18 Jun 2009 19:57:25 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-5038 I had a *TERRIBLE* experience with CitySearch pay-per-click also! 1. They would not apply my $50 coupon from 1and1.com until I called and complained to billing. 2. They prevent you from modifying the monthly budget and set the minimum monthly budget to $200. Then they charged me $260 a month, which was $60 over the budget they set! 3. They charge you $1.50 for anyone who views your company listing on their internal site. And do not allow you to modify that referral amount or verify the views are real. 4. I use Google Analytics and we had a total of 6 unique visitors during referred from CitySearch.com and CitySearch charged us for over 1000 referrals. I honestly think they are committing fraud, and I will be reporting them to the consumer protection agencies. In short, DO NOT USE CITY SEARCH! I had a *TERRIBLE* experience with CitySearch pay-per-click also!

1. They would not apply my $50 coupon from 1and1.com until I called and complained to billing.

2. They prevent you from modifying the monthly budget and set the minimum monthly budget to $200. Then they charged me $260 a month, which was $60 over the budget they set!

3. They charge you $1.50 for anyone who views your company listing on their internal site. And do not allow you to modify that referral amount or verify the views are real.

4. I use Google Analytics and we had a total of 6 unique visitors during referred from CitySearch.com and CitySearch charged us for over 1000 referrals.

I honestly think they are committing fraud, and I will be reporting them to the consumer protection agencies.

In short, DO NOT USE CITY SEARCH!

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-4924 Jill Olkoski Wed, 06 May 2009 18:54:38 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-4924 Hi Chris, Two things. First off, you should NEVER send your Google AdWords account and password to someone you don't know, much less post them in a public forum like a blog. To protect your privacy, I've removed your account, password and phone number. Secondly, this is a blog article not a contact form. If you want to hire someone for services, you should be contacting them via their contact form, rather than posting comments. Two very different methods, as posting comments is PUBLIC, while submitting a contact form is PRIVATE. Hi Chris,
Two things. First off, you should NEVER send your Google AdWords account and password to someone you don’t know, much less post them in a public forum like a blog. To protect your privacy, I’ve removed your account, password and phone number. Secondly, this is a blog article not a contact form. If you want to hire someone for services, you should be contacting them via their contact form, rather than posting comments. Two very different methods, as posting comments is PUBLIC, while submitting a contact form is PRIVATE.

]]> By: chris a meade http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-4923 chris a meade Wed, 06 May 2009 17:54:25 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-4923 I have a website and would like to get some help on optimizing it. What I am after is if I would type in door repair Dayton Ohio I would come up on the first page. My sign in google adwords should be XXXXX (removed by Jill) and the password should be xxxxxx (removed by Jill). (phone number removed by jill) I have a website and would like to get some help on optimizing it. What I am after is if I would type in door repair Dayton Ohio I would come up on the first page. My sign in google adwords should be XXXXX (removed by Jill) and the password should be xxxxxx (removed by Jill). (phone number removed by jill)

]]> By: Sully http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-4782 Sully Fri, 27 Mar 2009 06:04:54 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-4782 My Citysearch experience was mixed (mostly a pain). I signed up for their service because many competitors had it listed under their Google Local. So, Google Local influence is the only reason I signed up. And fortunately, when the site was added to my client's Google local listing, his rankings rose significantly for several search terms. However, in all the experience from a customer standpoint was horrible. I do extensive tacking on my site, also, and I saw ABSOLUTELY NO TRAFFIC coming from CitySearch or ANY other sites. There was NO CHANGE or increase in traffic, yet Citysearch was reporting that I had nearly 100 "connections". Their term connections is a scam in itself. Who pays for a "connection"? We pay for clicks throughs. I'm not sure if anyone else had a problem with the connections term scam but that is what got me. My Citysearch experience was mixed (mostly a pain). I signed up for their service because many competitors had it listed under their Google Local. So, Google Local influence is the only reason I signed up. And fortunately, when the site was added to my client’s Google local listing, his rankings rose significantly for several search terms.

However, in all the experience from a customer standpoint was horrible. I do extensive tacking on my site, also, and I saw ABSOLUTELY NO TRAFFIC coming from CitySearch or ANY other sites. There was NO CHANGE or increase in traffic, yet Citysearch was reporting that I had nearly 100 “connections”. Their term connections is a scam in itself. Who pays for a “connection”? We pay for clicks throughs. I’m not sure if anyone else had a problem with the connections term scam but that is what got me.

]]> By: James Beswick http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-4576 James Beswick Tue, 03 Feb 2009 21:01:36 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-4576 I'm glad I found your blog since we've just had a really bad experience with Citysearch. We paid $200 for a promised #1 listing that never happened, and got totally duped by these scam artists. I sent my complaint to the Bad Company blog and they listed the complaint here: http://badcompany.wordpress.com/2009/02/03/the-citysearch-advertising-scam/. Searching on Google, it seems that many vendors have falling for their scam and there's even a classaction lawsuit pending. I actually thought Citysearch was supposed to be a legitimate company but apparently not. I’m glad I found your blog since we’ve just had a really bad experience with Citysearch. We paid $200 for a promised #1 listing that never happened, and got totally duped by these scam artists. I sent my complaint to the Bad Company blog and they listed the complaint here: http://badcompany.wordpress.com/2009/02/03/the-citysearch-advertising-scam/. Searching on Google, it seems that many vendors have falling for their scam and there’s even a classaction lawsuit pending. I actually thought Citysearch was supposed to be a legitimate company but apparently not.

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2361 Jill Olkoski Tue, 23 Sep 2008 20:23:39 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2361 Hi citysearch revealed, The only part of your comment that I might disagree with, is that spiders (or web bots) can actually trigger a "click" and a visit. At least, in my experience, the vast majority of spiders indeed do not register as a real visitor. However I have seen evidence, very rarely, of badly designed spiders that will register as visitors. Rather I suspect (but can't prove) that they are able to drive up clicks by the method you're suggesting, but that these clicks are humans, albeit perhaps humans who are paid to do the clicking - click fraud at it's worst. I've seen articles about click farms in India, for example, who literally pay folks to do this. But I do appreciate your lengthy comment, although I wish you had put in a "real" email address, rather than a fake one - it would give your comment more integrity. Hi citysearch revealed,
The only part of your comment that I might disagree with, is that spiders (or web bots) can actually trigger a “click” and a visit. At least, in my experience, the vast majority of spiders indeed do not register as a real visitor. However I have seen evidence, very rarely, of badly designed spiders that will register as visitors.

Rather I suspect (but can’t prove) that they are able to drive up clicks by the method you’re suggesting, but that these clicks are humans, albeit perhaps humans who are paid to do the clicking – click fraud at it’s worst. I’ve seen articles about click farms in India, for example, who literally pay folks to do this.

But I do appreciate your lengthy comment, although I wish you had put in a “real” email address, rather than a fake one – it would give your comment more integrity.

]]> By: citysearch revealed http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2359 citysearch revealed Mon, 22 Sep 2008 22:01:02 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2359 Folks. Here’s how CitySearch rips you off…. Let’s say you own a dress shop in Chicago and you only serve the Chicago market. You contact CitySearch and setup a listing/profile page for your shop to be listed on CitySearch’s “Chicago” directory because that’s the market you serve. You give them a budget and guess what, you quickly receive enough visitors to your profile page to max out your monthly budget! It doesn’t seem to matter how high or low your budget, somehow you get enough clicks to max it out. How can this be? Gee golly how can your little dress business get so many hits? Especially when you don’t see an increase in business on your end. No phone calls, no emails, no big jump in visitors to your own web site, virtually nothing. The answer?…. drum roll please … When you sign up for a listing for your “Chicago” business to be posted on their “Chicago” focused pages, you think that’s all you get, right? Heck no. It turns out they also bury on their site dozens of additional links for your business. They post these buried links on pages that are devoted to other cities/markets. So, they list you in Chicago as expected. But they also place listings/links for your business on their pages for Atlanta, and Los Angeles, and Houston, and New York, and San Diego, and St. Louis, and so on. Each of these additional listings or links automatically “redirect” to your “Chicago” profile page when they are visited or “clicked” … once clicked, presto! You are charged for the visit to your profile page. Remberber, CitySearch charges you when someone (or something) lands on your profile page, not on your own web site. Now, these links are quite buried so no actual person will find them in a normal search. So who finds them? Search engine spiders do. There are thousands of them out there that race around the web day and night. They follow every link they can find no matter how buried the link may be. These automated spiders are used by firms like Google, or Yahoo, or lesser known search engines to catalogue the entire web. Anyway, when you have dozens of links plastered all over CitySearch’s site you’re gonna get “hit” by these spiders and then get charged by CitySearch. How can you verify what I’m saying? How can you tell if CitySearch has listed your firm on dozens of pages that have nothing to do with your geographic market? Simple. Do a Google search that contains two terms. 1) Your company name (it helps if your company name is fairly unique) and 2) the word CitySearch. What you’ll find are links to your paid listing in the city you chose, but also dozens of other listings in random cities around the country. Google may determine many of these listings are very similar and post the following text at the bottom of their search results list: “In order to show you the most relevant results, we (Google) have omitted some entries very similar to the (#) already displayed. If you like, you can (link starts here) repeat the search with the omitted results included.” Press that link and you’ll see all the additional links CitySearch has posted. Links that you did not request and that do not apply to your business’ geographic territory (assuming you are a small or mid-sized company with a regional focus). Press any of those additional CitySearch links, say the Atlanta link, and it will automatically forward to your Chicago profile page. Congratulations, you just charged youself for a visit! In addition to the links on dozens of CitySearch City pages that are unrelated to your business market/geography, they give your info to “partners” who post links to your profile page on their web sites. Some of these will not be geography specific either. But CitySearch doesn’t care. What they want are as many links to your profile page as possible. More links means more clicks (even clicks by spiders). More clicks means they make more money. Simple as that. Anyway, there’s a good reason why they create “profile” pages for you and charge you when the “profile” page is selected. I mean, wouldn’t it be better if they sent people directly to your website instead? After all, you’ve likely invested a lot of time and money on your site to communicate your brand, what you sell, etc. Do you really need a profile page with your address and contact info? That’s already on your own site! What gives here? The reason they and others like Yellowpages use “profile pages” is so you cannot see and monitor in detail the click activity for that profile page. They control the page, they control the server, they control the data. All you get from them are crude visitor reports. If they charged you when people clicked directly to your actual web site then you would be able to monitor the activity in great detail. How so? Well, if you have a decent web analytics program you could see what time of day the clicks occur on your site. If a lot of the clicks occur between midnight and 5 a.m. there’s a huge chance the clicks are not human, rather they are spider activated. Or worse they are activated by humans who are overseas and paid pennies to click on sites like yours to raise the click count. Here’s another thing you can check with a good analytic program …. How long are the visitors on your site? If a lot of the visits are less than 1 second then you know the visit was by a spider. They come and go within milliseconds and show up on most analytic programs as a 0 second or 1 second visit. Again, you can only monitor this sort of stuff on your own site with a tool like Google Analytics (a free program). But since you are charged for clicks on your CitySearch profile page, you are at their mercy when it comes to reporting. And all they share with you are raw visits or something like that. And as I’ve discussed you have no way of knowing who or what caused those visits, when they occured, and so on. I have talked with CitySearch’s click fraud team (the foxes that guard the hen house) in the past and demanded more detailed reports. I was promised them but was also told that they would take weeks to produce. Did they ever send them? No. They never called back. They never sent the reports. I can’t say I was surprised. In closing, I see someone has initiated a class-action lawsuit against CitySearch. I wish them luck. Folks. Here’s how CitySearch rips you off….

Let’s say you own a dress shop in Chicago and you only serve the Chicago market. You contact CitySearch and setup a listing/profile page for your shop to be listed on CitySearch’s “Chicago” directory because that’s the market you serve. You give them a budget and guess what, you quickly receive enough visitors to your profile page to max out your monthly budget! It doesn’t seem to matter how high or low your budget, somehow you get enough clicks to max it out. How can this be? Gee golly how can your little dress business get so many hits? Especially when you don’t see an increase in business on your end. No phone calls, no emails, no big jump in visitors to your own web site, virtually nothing.

The answer?…. drum roll please …

When you sign up for a listing for your “Chicago” business to be posted on their “Chicago” focused pages, you think that’s all you get, right? Heck no. It turns out they also bury on their site dozens of additional links for your business. They post these buried links on pages that are devoted to other cities/markets. So, they list you in Chicago as expected. But they also place listings/links for your business on their pages for Atlanta, and Los Angeles, and Houston, and New York, and San Diego, and St. Louis, and so on. Each of these additional listings or links automatically “redirect” to your “Chicago” profile page when they are visited or “clicked” … once clicked, presto! You are charged for the visit to your profile page. Remberber, CitySearch charges you when someone (or something) lands on your profile page, not on your own web site.

Now, these links are quite buried so no actual person will find them in a normal search. So who finds them? Search engine spiders do.

There are thousands of them out there that race around the web day and night. They follow every link they can find no matter how buried the link may be. These automated spiders are used by firms like Google, or Yahoo, or lesser known search engines to catalogue the entire web. Anyway, when you have dozens of links plastered all over CitySearch’s site you’re gonna get “hit” by these spiders and then get charged by CitySearch.

How can you verify what I’m saying? How can you tell if CitySearch has listed your firm on dozens of pages that have nothing to do with your geographic market? Simple. Do a Google search that contains two terms. 1) Your company name (it helps if your company name is fairly unique) and 2) the word CitySearch. What you’ll find are links to your paid listing in the city you chose, but also dozens of other listings in random cities around the country. Google may determine many of these listings are very similar and post the following text at the bottom of their search results list: “In order to show you the most relevant results, we (Google) have omitted some entries very similar to the (#) already displayed. If you like, you can (link starts here) repeat the search with the omitted results included.” Press that link and you’ll see all the additional links CitySearch has posted. Links that you did not request and that do not apply to your business’ geographic territory (assuming you are a small or mid-sized company with a regional focus). Press any of those additional CitySearch links, say the Atlanta link, and it will automatically forward to your Chicago profile page. Congratulations, you just charged youself for a visit!

In addition to the links on dozens of CitySearch City pages that are unrelated to your business market/geography, they give your info to “partners” who post links to your profile page on their web sites. Some of these will not be geography specific either. But CitySearch doesn’t care. What they want are as many links to your profile page as possible. More links means more clicks (even clicks by spiders). More clicks means they make more money. Simple as that.

Anyway, there’s a good reason why they create “profile” pages for you and charge you when the “profile” page is selected. I mean, wouldn’t it be better if they sent people directly to your website instead? After all, you’ve likely invested a lot of time and money on your site to communicate your brand, what you sell, etc. Do you really need a profile page with your address and contact info? That’s already on your own site! What gives here?

The reason they and others like Yellowpages use “profile pages” is so you cannot see and monitor in detail the click activity for that profile page. They control the page, they control the server, they control the data. All you get from them are crude visitor reports. If they charged you when people clicked directly to your actual web site then you would be able to monitor the activity in great detail. How so? Well, if you have a decent web analytics program you could see what time of day the clicks occur on your site. If a lot of the clicks occur between midnight and 5 a.m. there’s a huge chance the clicks are not human, rather they are spider activated. Or worse they are activated by humans who are overseas and paid pennies to click on sites like yours to raise the click count. Here’s another thing you can check with a good analytic program …. How long are the visitors on your site? If a lot of the visits are less than 1 second then you know the visit was by a spider. They come and go within milliseconds and show up on most analytic programs as a 0 second or 1 second visit. Again, you can only monitor this sort of stuff on your own site with a tool like Google Analytics (a free program). But since you are charged for clicks on your CitySearch profile page, you are at their mercy when it comes to reporting. And all they share with you are raw visits or something like that. And as I’ve discussed you have no way of knowing who or what caused those visits, when they occured, and so on. I have talked with CitySearch’s click fraud team (the foxes that guard the hen house) in the past and demanded more detailed reports. I was promised them but was also told that they would take weeks to produce. Did they ever send them? No. They never called back. They never sent the reports. I can’t say I was surprised.

In closing, I see someone has initiated a class-action lawsuit against CitySearch. I wish them luck.

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2067 Jill Olkoski Fri, 11 Jul 2008 18:16:52 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2067 Hi Melissa, I'm glad you found this post too! Whew, that was close! Jill Hi Melissa,
I’m glad you found this post too! Whew, that was close!
Jill

]]> By: Melissa http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2066 Melissa Fri, 11 Jul 2008 17:51:40 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2066 I am so glad I found this website. I was just getting ready to sign a contract for a 3 month period with Citysearch and decided to investigate and get my research in. My boss would have killed me if I decided to get scammed and his budgeting money wasted. Thanks for the information before I made a BIG mistake! Melissa I am so glad I found this website. I was just getting ready to sign a contract for a 3 month period with Citysearch and decided to investigate and get my research in. My boss would have killed me if I decided to get scammed and his budgeting money wasted.
Thanks for the information before I made a BIG mistake!
Melissa

]]> By: Jill Olkoski http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2063 Jill Olkoski Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:06:14 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2063 Hi Chad, I'm really sorry to hear about your experience with Citysearch. I do believe there is currently a lawsuit going on prompted by one of the folks who found my blog article. His name is Tom Lambotte and here's his website: The San Diego Mac Tutor: http://www.thesandiegomactutor.com/the_San_Diego_Mac_Tutor_-_Apple_help,_training_and_Support.html Here's a CNET article: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13577_3-9952955-36.html?hhTest=1 Hi Chad,
I’m really sorry to hear about your experience with Citysearch. I do believe there is currently a lawsuit going on prompted by one of the folks who found my blog article. His name is Tom Lambotte and here’s his website: The San Diego Mac Tutor: http://www.thesandiegomactutor.com/the_San_Diego_Mac_Tutor_-_Apple_help,_training_and_Support.html

Here’s a CNET article:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13577_3-9952955-36.html?hhTest=1

]]> By: Chad Bordeaux http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/my-adventure-with-city-search-pay-per-click-advertising-and-click-fraud/comment-page-1/#comment-2062 Chad Bordeaux Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:48:35 +0000 http://aldebaranwebdesign.com/blog/?p=6#comment-2062 I am in the middle of a similar situation with CitySearch. I wish I had found this post before I signed up. I have been with them approximately 3 months now. They hooked me up on one of those 6-month contracts, with a 30 cent per click charge and a $200 budget. To date, their system is showing that 1,352 "connections" have viewed my city search ad. We are a payroll firm and have very limited competition (only 1 other Company) advertising on CitySearch. I guess I should have known it was a scam if none of the Big Boys were doing it. Anyways, out of the 1,352 "connections," I have yet to have a click through to my website from CitySearch - not one. The rep I spoke with today said that that isn't how most people use the web. He said that most people would contact me from that ad, not click through to my website. That I highly doubt. The first thing I am going to do if I am a customer looking for anything is go to the Companies website for more information. Even so, he is actually arguing that it is possible that absolutely no one clicked the web link to my site. Surely, out of 1,352 connections, someone would have accidentally clicked it. I told him I wanted to cancel and he said he could put the order through, but it would bill at the $200/month budget until the end of the contract - despite the fact that my last two bills have only been $141.35 and $149.15. In other words, they are screwing me. I am not through with them though. I wish I had read this before I signed up. I am in the middle of a similar situation with CitySearch. I wish I had found this post before I signed up. I have been with them approximately 3 months now. They hooked me up on one of those 6-month contracts, with a 30 cent per click charge and a $200 budget. To date, their system is showing that 1,352 “connections” have viewed my city search ad. We are a payroll firm and have very limited competition (only 1 other Company) advertising on CitySearch. I guess I should have known it was a scam if none of the Big Boys were doing it.

Anyways, out of the 1,352 “connections,” I have yet to have a click through to my website from CitySearch – not one. The rep I spoke with today said that that isn’t how most people use the web. He said that most people would contact me from that ad, not click through to my website. That I highly doubt. The first thing I am going to do if I am a customer looking for anything is go to the Companies website for more information. Even so, he is actually arguing that it is possible that absolutely no one clicked the web link to my site. Surely, out of 1,352 connections, someone would have accidentally clicked it.

I told him I wanted to cancel and he said he could put the order through, but it would bill at the $200/month budget until the end of the contract – despite the fact that my last two bills have only been $141.35 and $149.15. In other words, they are screwing me.

I am not through with them though. I wish I had read this before I signed up.

]]>